Olympus: Get ready for a new type of camera

[Matt]

This is big!

This is without doubt the most exciting digital photography announcement this year. It's fair to say that this "extension / addition" to the Four Thirds standard is finally able to deliver on the original promise of that format; considerably smaller and lighter lenses and bodies. Olympus are however keen to stress that this in no way replaces Four Thirds which will continue with new Four Thirds bodies and lenses in the future.

Phil - DPReview.com

This is what I have been waiting for. This will be the next generation of cameras. I would expect other manufacturers to follow within a few years- but this could put Olympus in the lead if done right.

Imagine... compact cameras that take DSLR lenses, have no mirrors (so they last longer and shoot faster with less shake), support existing lenses, have a set of new lenses that are considerably smaller with no loss of speed, with support for faster communication and more technology--- Allows these cameras to be used as motion cameras as well!
I can just imagine using my existing 12-60 or 70-300 for film! Awesome!

I hope we'll see a hint of these cameras this year. A dream situation would be a first model out for next spring!

Olympus Imaging and Panasonic announce new Micro Four Thirds System standard

More here:
http://www.dpreview.com/news/0808/08080 ... thirds.asp
Note: DPreview is notorious for being anti-Olympus/pro Canon

[skiboarder72]

Smaller sensor = more high ISO grain
Bigger sensor = More detail
More megapixels on same size sensor = more grain


Its also true that Smaller sensor = Smaller lenses needed. If they can somehow prove the above basic guidelines wrong more power to them but I call marketing BS if they expect quality to be on par with ever other DSLR on the market. Their sensor size is 30-40% smaller than a AP-C sensor in a Nikon or Canon and about 1/4 the size of a full frame DSLR. If they are competing on size only, sure a 4/3rd sensor will be great for compact cameras but it will never touch the other SLR's unless they come out with something revolutionary (which I would like because it would mean Nikon and Canon would have to fight back twice as hard).

[Matt]

Smaller sensor = more high ISO grain
Bigger sensor = More detail
More megapixels on same size sensor = more grain

You're reading too many online canon message boards. This is one of those myths I hear all the time that people shoot off as if it were some law of optics. It's like back in the 60s when people would predict that the powerful computers of the future would be the size of city blocks. That's all they knew- more power meant larger computers.
It was the companies that worked on minimization that left the others in the dust.

"Sensor size to noise" is a fraction of what it used to be and will be a non-issue in a few years. Every camera manufacturer claims to be able to defeat in the near future. In fact, sensors today dominate over film when it comes to low-light noise. People tend to forget we are shooting at a noise tolerance well above what film has managed for decades. Most of the noise people complain about (or even pass on a camera because of) is something they would never notice in day-to-day shooting. You take a look at the E3 that people consider a noisy camera. People use this as a reason not to buy the camera. Yet tests from major photography publications show that the noise difference compared to competitors is negligible. Yikes- what a reason to miss out on state-of-the-art hardware.

They used to say the same thing about CMOS sensors (don't buy them they are noisy and the performance is not as good as CCD) - which now is not even an issue (if not the reverse)- as
Yeah, pixel density is a factor with noise and detail, but how would that explain the more detailed sensors of today with higher megapixels and more noise? New technology (like the micro-lenses that cover the individual pixels on a sensor) that counter it.

Olympus's announcement is a big one because they will not let this noise issue stop them from innovating. They are bringing back the rangefinder camera- and the possibilities are startling. Imagine opening SRL lenses to video cameras. Imagine being able to change lenses on a closed system with no worries about dust or moisture. Imagine a pocket camera that can take 300mm. Imagine a pro camera that won't need a mirror shutter replacement after 140k releases.

Is seeing a slightly less level of noise when zoomed in at 100% (and looking for noise) is that more groundbreaking?

[skiboarder72]

Well ya I totally agree with you matt and take a camera like the D3. You can get pretty much noise free images at ISO 6400. This will allow you to use slower and thus smaller and less expensive lenses. Idk about you but I love being able to take my D300 into a dim bar and take pictures without a flash. The slightly smaller olympus sensors get more noise in most tests, is it a huge difference? NO! Maybe 1 stop at most. Look at point and shoots, they have a tiny sensor and can't shoot above ISO 800 to save their life. Sensor size still plays into the noise a camera makes still I agree with you when you say it is becoming less and less of an issue but unless olympus just had a huge breakthough in sensor technology I don't think this will be anything revolutionary. Look at a D100 to a D300... same size sensor, 5 years later the D300 it can shoot 2 stops higher than the D100 with the same noise level. Of course its moving that way... but thats not news thats common sense. It just seems like olympus is saying, "In the future we will have smaller cameras and lenses that will be able to take low noise images and higher quality images," every camera manufacturer says that.

The added bonus of using the lenses for motion picture movies is pretty cool though

[Matt]

You take a look at the first 4/3rds sensor's noise to the ones used today and despite no size difference, noise is cut by more than half. Noise is not directly related to image size, despite what some people may say... there's just no law correlating the two.

You can't infinitely increase the ISO- eventually it's going to be no noise what the eye can barely see.
My new Canon pocket does miracles at what a predecessor couldn't do 4 years ago.
Noise is the IT THING today... but for the future- it's going to be something else.... now that we've tackled noise... what about all the shit we've put up with in order to avoid it--- larger sensors, cameras, lens technology? Can we move on? It's good to see three manufacturers moving on (Oly, Panasonic, Kodak) thinking ahead.
I would expect, and from what manufacturers are saying ... two years and manufacturers will have it down to a level where we won't even include it in our buying decisions.

Regardless os sensor size, rangefinder-like cameras will bring millions to the Oly camp. Most consumers don't know, or care about sensor size. They look at overall camera capabilities. Especially when one camera has something like HD video and the other will need a new shutter in 140k presses.

I'm going to make a bold prediction here: within 5 years, all manufacturers will follow this lead and start eliminating mirrors from their cameras.

[skiboarder72]

But what about the people that like looking through the lens when they take a picture...

Interesting Discussion on Sensors... just came out today, this show is addicting!

http://www.pixelcorps.tv/twip042

[Matt]

Those will still be around.
Plus there will still be viewfinders... EVF- with high resolution LCDs - with gain-up for low light-- so it will even better for you low-light shooters!

[hoohaa]

I wouldn't jump at anything like this, personally.

If I want a compact camera, I don't want it to be complex. I want it to be something that fits in my pocket, has a few settings, takes a little video and all that.

If I want something that I can get creative with, I want a DSLR with all the bells and whistles. I like my current setup and if I can ever afford it, I'll take the next step in Canon cameras. I've tried some Olympus cameras and never liked the feel/touch of them. It's a personal preference.

It's funny because I was chatting in the city with this gal who is a Nikon user. She likes both Nikon and Canon, which is very odd.

I said I didn't like Nikon (I used Nikon quite extensively before and never liked the cameras) and she asked why. I replied "I'm a Canon person." She said "Enough said."

I'm sure once this all comes out a bit more, Shutterbug will have an article or two on it and I'll read it more in-depth then. It's interesting, but, not something I'd personally go through hoops for.